Do you 'buzz'?

[megga]

How many of you use 'buzzing' as a practice method?
Craig Anderson brought this subject up at last nights rehearsal, saying (if I understood him correctly) that the way to improve ones intonation and tone production is through the practice of 'free buzzing', ie. producing a note of a prescribed pitch with the lips and without the support of the mouthpiece/instrument.
Apparently we should all be able to do this! Well I can't even buzz never mind buzz say a middle C to order. It's not something I've ever been taught to do. I remember my first cornet lesson and my teacher telling me: 'Imagine you're spitting a grain of rice off the end of your tongue and blow', and with that, the cornet was thrust into my hands and away I went.
I understand that many beginners today are taught using this method (buzzing, not the grain of rice thing ); they don't get an instrument in their hands until they can successfully free buzz a tune, then buzz with good sound on a mouthpiece alone. Only then do they get to play an instrument.
Wait a minute though! If I can't 'free buzz' how can I make any kind of half decent sound on the instrument? I must be buzzing (it's probably my head that's buzzing ;D)otherwise there would be no sound at all right?
You may have noticed - if you've read my other rants - that the technical aspects of playing a brass instrument really fascinate me. Fascinate and frustrate if you want the truth. Frustrating because I always get the feeling that there must be hundreds of players out there who really know about all this stuff and use it to great effect in the superb performances that they give, and then there's people like me; the 'uninitiated' who might possibly be much better players today had they been given the benefit of this teaching as a beginner.
Ah well, Que sera as they say.

[surfer]

I dont but suppose I should do. I tried it a few times and found it made my lips tingly.

[thedoctor]

I've been doing it for years without even thinking how it could improve intonation etc.Sandy Cochrane taught me how to buzz when i joined Dysart as a sprog,christ thats more than 25 years ago,how time fly's.
If you can do it right it sounds like a good tight fart that you can vary the pitch,i suppose thats the best way to describe it. ;D

Admin: The standard of technical discussion on this forum is quite outstanding! ;D

[surfer]

thedoctor said:

If you can do it right it sounds like a good tight fart that you can vary the pitch,i suppose thats the best way to describe it. ;D

A good description as any Neil ;D

[cornetcheese]

megga said:

How many of you use 'buzzing' as a practice method?

I thought everyone did this? I`ve always buzzed without the mouthpiece since I started playing, usually buzzing scales and lip flexibilities... Can`t really say it`s made me a good player though!

All the players I know from college and the ones here in japan do it too - it was the first thing I was taught, as my teacher initially got me to practise for one week buzzing, then 2 weeks with only a mouthpiece, then I got an instrument... I can`t believe not all teachers teach this - it`s very basic!

I also had a shock when I realised a good player I know had never been taught to tongue, hence he sometimes went slightly out of time in quick pieces and notes sometimes didn`t sound - it`s appalling to think there are teachers out there who don`t know how to teach the most basic aspects of brass playing!!!

[megga]

cornetcheese said:

megga said:

How many of you use 'buzzing' as a practice method?

... I can`t believe not all teachers teach this - it`s very basic!

Remember we are going back some time here Alan. I'm talking about circa 1968 when I started learning, and I'm not sure if some of these teaching methods were on the go at that time.
My teacher Jimmy Blair wasn't a 'qualified' brass tutor either. He was just a member of the Cowdenbeath band at the time who was good enough to give of his own time five nights a week to teach kids.
While the methods might have been less than textbook, he still managed to turn out some great players so he must have been doing something right.

[scotty]

First thing i got taught to do was buzz on its own then in the mouthpiece!

My tutor at uni (Gavin Spowart) is pretty keen on it says it gets the blood in your chops (that tingly felling) and stops your embouchure from getting lazy, it does help so im trying to do it a lot more than i did.

[surfer]

Gavin taught me 26 years ago when he was a student at Napier, a pound a night I think. One of the best players about at that time. Great guy. I think he was only 18 then and I was 13-14 and needed some tuition. Following on from what craig said though, it was Jimmy Blair who taught me first and he was one of the nicest guys around. Somehow I feel if he was still here there would be a lot more youngsters at Cowdenbeath (sorry, Kingdom)

[euphantastic]

I think there all drinking petrol nowadays.

They get their buzz from that.

[cornetcheese]

Ah sorry craig, my misunderstanding! I guess that when it`s a case of learning through a band with someone who isn`t qualified they would teach in a different way, related to their own experience.

[surfer]

Sorry Alan but I hope that was not aimed at Jimmy Blair who could teach a player from the playground up. I've got the upmost respect for the guy and the fact that a few players keep his name cropping up shows a lot of us did to.

[bassboy]

On the topic of buzzing (with a mouthpiece) Andy Berryman was telling me when he was up at Kinneil that he buzzes wth a trumpet mouthpiece. Basically the idea is that it gives the bits of his mouth that are used playing the trombone a rest, and encourages the bits that he doesn't use when playing the trombone to get more exercised.

He was also saying that I should get a trombone mouthpiece for buzzing, as for tuba players this can work on the same principle. He says a lot of orchestral players work this way.

Don't think I have explained that very well but hopefully you understand the message.

[cornetcheese]

surfer said:

Sorry Alan but I hope that was not aimed at Jimmy Blair who could teach a player from the playground up. I've got the upmost respect for the guy and the fact that a few players keep his name cropping up shows a lot of us did to.

I didn`t aim that comment in a negative way at anyone - I don`t know Jimmy Blair so I would never pass comment on his tuition! I`m not saying that tuition from non-qualified teachers is in any way of a lower standard than that of qualified teachers - I know in many cases of fantastic teachers who hold no qualification whatsoever, and equally of highly qualified teachers who are pretty dreadful! I do think there is a problem with certain teachers though, who don`t teach anything about the basics of playing whatsoever (tonguing for example!!!). It means that a player can get to a decent standard, only to find that they can`t go any further as there is a fundamental basic thing that they were never taught, hence they learned to play without knowing a basic aspect of playing. This has nothing to do with how many qualifications someone holds, but a great deal to do with their teaching ability!

I know of several cases of players who were badly taught and have encountered massive obstacles as a result - the player I mentioned who was never taught tonguing is a great example, it meant he had to relearn huge aspects of playing because of this. Had he been taught well, he could have been at an even higher standard than he was at!

[megga]

surfer said:

I do think there is a problem with certain teachers though, who don`t teach anything about the basics of playing whatsoever (tonguing for example!!!). It means that a player can get to a decent standard, only to find that they can`t go any further as there is a fundamental basic thing that they were never taught, hence they learned to play without knowing a basic aspect of playing.

Is it true though to say that a player who hasn't been tutored well in the basics can't go any further? Can't these techniques be adopted and practiced by even some older players so that they might see some kind of improvement in their playing ability?
Most older players would probably reason that if it ain't broke, don't fix it. They'd probably argue that they've got bye for all these years in a Championship section band without 'free buzzing', or 'circular breathing' or any other of these techniques, so why start trying to learn it all now.
Well, obviously if you're happy then don't bother. Me, I wouldn'd mind giving it a go. I've still got a few good years in me yet I think ;D.

[pjaye]

Cant remember how I was shown... I always had a problem producing a note on a cornet cos i pitched too high so i got told to produce the notes just through the mouth piece... i managed in the end the C scale on a sop but after reading this thought i'd give "free buzzing" a shot needless to say i think my parents think im mad... But i cant do it at all... I'll stick with my mouth piece buzzing which works well when i try